Do I keep AHRDF going ?

[VK4ADC]

Each year at this time I receive the domain renewal notice for AHRDF.NET and I think "Do I keep AHRDF going ?".  

Throughout the year the activity with the new posts is like a seesaw. There have been periods recently where there have not been any new posts - or responses - for 2 weeks or so and then there is a bit of a flurry of activity.  Consistent - it is not.   The problem arises when you consider that most returning/recurring visitors are expecting to see something new on the Forum, and when there isn't then they are likely to go away at some point - and stay away.

Sure, there are often visitors searching for info of some kind and a search engine has pointed to the Forum as a possible match against key words and some of the visitors probably find something of use.  Then again maybe not.  It exists, but to what end. This activity is not quantifiable in any worthwhile way.

Let's face it, it does cost to  keep the domain name going year after year plus there are some hosting costs attributable, and that comes out of my pocket. 

And so the annual question arises yet again : Do I keep it going - or not ??  

Doug, admin

[VK3RX]

How much are you paying?

My annual domain renewal is about $US15.

[VK4ADC]

Damien

The domain renewal fee is $US20 but it is not just that cost that reflects on whether to keep AHRDF "on-air".  The renewal simply serves as a reminder that a decision again needs to be made, after reviewing how much value it is to the amateur community, as based on activity obvious through useage. 

The hosting service software versions are not being updated (and I am advised won't be) and eventually that means that the MYBB package that is used for AHRDF will run out of road for security and reliability patches.  A later major version (4 versus 3) has been available for some time but requires recent PHP and SQL version support.  Sure, I could move to more expensive hosting that has the latest and greatest versions but (again) that comes out of my pocket, and is it worthwhile if the Forum usage rate is - and remains - low ?

This "issue" crosses my mind each year and there is no outright answer. So I continue to pose the question : Do I keep AHRDF going ?

Doug, admin

[VK3BA]

G'day Doug,

Please keep it going. I understand the activity levels have been all over the shop in recent times - let's blame it on Covid like everyone else does! Like a lot of things in the technical pursuit of Amateur Radio, some things come and go and some things come from a sleep to active again. Thanks for maintaining this forum - I appreciate it.

One could assume activity here has been a bit quiet lately, but all it takes is a fruity topic and off we go.

Keep up your great work, Doug!

Cheers,

[VK4ADC]

Well the 'good news' is that AHRDF.NET lives on for another year.  

The domain name has been renewed for a year but will again be the subject of what I think they now call a specific "performance review" in May/June 2024 to determine if it continues after that.  Why then ? Because that is when I decide whether to pay the domain renewal fee...

That performance review period is actually the next 12 months, and not just those weeks, and is a case of determining overall use/activity by registered members. I do not care about visits by unknown visitors, regardless of the magnitude of their numbers.  This forum is not run for the visitors, only members, and if the amateur vistors register and become members, only then will they become a significant factor.

Recently there was a period of 12 to 14 days between subsequent posts, and that lack of use going forward really will kill off the Forum in July 2024.

Doug, admin

[VK3RX]

I do not care about visits by unknown visitors, regardless of the magnitude of their numbers. 

Do you class "unknown visitors" as people who look at the site without logging in?

I check the site daily i.e. look at the "Latest Posts" list but don't log in unless I have something to say, and I suspect other registered users may be doing the same.

[VK4ADC]

Damien

Yes I do. The visitor numbers may be comprised of a number of registered users/'people' who don't log in, but many are search engine 'bots' and referrals from the search engines because there may be a tentative match between a search term, or part thereof, and the content on the AHRDF site.  Those latter "visitors" are not why the Forum exists.

You may wonder why it is important to me. Well the reason for that is that I expend money and time in running the forum and I do not want to waste either if the forum is not going to be used for its intended purpose : to act as a medium to distribute information of interest to amateur radio operators, and to provide a forum for their discussion.  Visitors are generally not going to provide anything of interest to the forum or its users, so I do not see value in taking those numbers into account.

I do have the option of making visitors actually log in to see content, just like the old VKLogger forum did for at least part of its time.  I don't want to force the issue but not doing so makes it impossible to determine real visitors from everything else. The IP addresses of all visitors is logged, logged in or not, but the only ready or easy way to determine who-is-who is to see the list of user's callsigns.

So lack of posts equals inactivity equals a waste of resources.  Back some years ago, there was a call about the ham bands : 'Use it or lose it", and the same principle applies to this forum.

Doug, admin

[VK5PJ]

Hello Doug,
it seems to be hard for many to get past the "I have nothing interesting to write about" speed hump for many hams but they do not realise that there is a lot of hidden wisdom in their lives. My local club has latched onto my recent appearance in AR mag and a few of us have been asked to do presentations, (VK5BC get your pen warmed up for your WIA awards walk through) for club meetings.

I wish there was some wonder drug that could get people past the speed hump so they could get onto the keyboard but terminal modesty or death scrolling on social media seem to be the limit for many.

[VK6MIK]

I'd ask the wia if they can advertise it on the website and magazine for free.
I was surprised a discussion board wasn't a member service
Regards Michael VK6MIK

[VK3RX]

Peter's post above has prompted me to file something I'd written for the OTN a while back, so here's two posts by me to add to the activity log ....

[VK7ZPD]

I think the forum should be kept running, I used it this morning to see whether VKCL was still current for the Trans Tasman. How you get the usage up I'm not sure, IMO forums are the best place for information exchange, my observation with the Amateur community is that hams seem to be poor at exchanging information, any good searchable resource is invaluable. IMO facebook and to an extent youtube are a means of users feeding their egos, watching a youtube video for 10 or 15 minutes to find out something that could be covered in a sigle page with a couple of screenshots is time wasted. Good luck searching FB that's if you're even part of the correct group.

I'm going to make an effort to post more often.

Thanks Doug for keeping it running and your efforts in the past,

[VK4ADC]

Philip

The ease of forum referencing versus the likes of Facebook has been apparent for a number of years, and you are right : no one gets to see within a Facebook group unless it is either (1) open to the public; or (2) you are a duly authorised signed-up member.  Unlike that, this forum is open to view but intentionally closed to post, and that last part has a lot to do with ensuring that posts are generated by known users with a sense of responsibility.

I could fill this forum with posts of interest and relevance to AR but it needs others' contributions and questions, not just mine.   There was a recent burst about station earthing with a few examples of how some have done it in practice and these posts do help others to plan their own earthing plans - but a quick flash and 'the pan' is again clean.  It could be an even better reference for others if more users made their own contributions apparent.  Given there is a full search facility built into the forum, it is surprising that more visitors do not use it rather than just rely on the likes of the Google search results.

There will be an "end of the road" for the forum sometime if for no other reason that the code package it uses will no longer be supported.  Whether that is by next June/July, or the one after that, or the one after that..., it will happen eventually.    There is an updated major version available but it will not run on the existing package hosting service (yes, I have asked if they plan to update the necessities of PHP, SQL etc and their response is more $$$$) so I am not going there. 

Doug, admin

[VK4ADC]

year-The very first post under this topic:

15th June 2023
Each year at this time I receive the domain renewal notice for AHRDF.NET and I think "Do I keep AHRDF going ?".  

Throughout the year the activity with the new posts is like a seesaw. There have been periods recently where there have not been any new posts - or responses - for 2 weeks or so and then there is a bit of a flurry of activity.  Consistent - it is not.   The problem arises when you consider that most returning/recurring visitors are expecting to see something new on the Forum, and when there isn't then they are likely to go away at some point - and stay away.

Sure, there are often visitors searching for info of some kind and a search engine has pointed to the Forum as a possible match against key words and some of the visitors probably find something of use.  Then again maybe not.  It exists, but to what end. This activity is not quantifiable in any worthwhile way.

Let's face it, it does cost to  keep the domain name going year after year plus there are some hosting costs attributable, and that comes out of my pocket. 
And so the annual question arises yet again : Do I keep it going - or not ??  
Doug, admin

So, nearly a year on and I have been assessing the activity on the forum - yet again.  There has been one new topic/post in nearly 3 weeks, that is ONE only, and it has me wondering about the value of MY efforts in keeping the forum available. And, yes, the domain renewal is again drawing near so a payment will be required before too long to retain the domain name.

I raised a question with a few WIA board members while at the recent WIA AGM in Bundaberg : why doesn't the WIA run a discussion forum for Australian amateurs ( - in lieu of me ) ??   The response was along the lines of "we would need volunteers to run it if we did". (none above is exact wording)  So while they aren't seeming against the idea, they weren't totally for it either. That leaves the AHRDF in play, for now.

Running the forum is a burden needing a fair amount of time to do properly. Every post has to be read, some are edited, approved if moderated, manually check new user/member requests for validity and then approve, and this can swallow up hunks of time when the forum gets busy.  Even if it isn't busy you still have to visit multiple times a day to see if there are new posts ! The last few months has seen a surge in hack attempts, and that requires time to deal with.  So it is not all fun, but needs to be done, and done properly.

My current thinking is that I will support it until the mid-2025's domain renewal draws close (so a year or so away) and if it isn't being used enough then it will just disappear one day. Poof ! No warning, just poof..  It would take me about 30 seconds to do just that, and sometimes it is oh-so-tempting..

Doug, admin

[VK5PJ]

Hello Doug,
I think in general the big organisations like the WIA and the like stay away from running forums as they only see the "damage to reputation" side of it should a forum member run rouge and start slandering people or get super political about a club decision. These organisations seem to be happy to support others running these systems but are worried if they run them, that comments by moderators will be construed as "club policy" so all the disclaimers tend to appear on every post "this opinion does not directly represent the policy of the club".

So the little blokes like you who can act solo tend to lump the load as you can slash and burn if needed.

[VK4UH]

Perhaps you might consider seeking donations to support the financial burden or even an annual subscription to cover costs?  Im in Favour of keeping the service alive but have seen activity decline.  if more posted then more would check in more regularly

[VK2AZ]

I'm certain it's not about money.
Very few people will appreciate the amount of time that has to be put into these things without much benefit to the community.

Keep it going if you can Doug. You are doing a great service to our community.

Thank you.

[VK2PAH]

Hi. I just joined and quickly realised that two things are missing which many others would appreciate, because it is common elsewhere. They are...
To provide 'like' button. Everyone likes to be liked.
Humour or fun page, just to get a break from the seriousness of technical stuff. After all, we hams are not a glum lot.

Anyway, I hope this forum will pick up. Where everyone has at least a reason to check in to see what's new, how their own post is getting along (or if it was liked), and to chill out with some fun, or game, to read (or recommended new books), things to do or share.

[VK4ADC]

Welcome to the forum.

I intentionally did not include "likes" in the forum setup.  My opinion (which could be wrong) is that they distract from the real message in the post. The 'message' is what is important and not whether others push a pseudo-button to show their support - or not - for the topic. And the 'New Reply' button is there for people to cast their own comments upon the sometimes murky waters...

The place for 'off-topic' comments/discussion/funny things is already there under "General discussion" - strangely marked as "General discussion - When it doesn't fit anywhere else".

Doug, admin

[VK2PAH]

Welcome to the forum.

I intentionally did not include "likes" in the forum setup.  My opinion (which could be wrong) is that they distract from the real message in the post. The 'message' is what is important and not whether others push a pseudo-button to show their support - or not - for the topic. And the 'New Reply' button is there for people to cast their own comments upon the sometimes murky waters...

The place for 'off-topic' comments/discussion/funny things is already there under "General discussion" - strangely marked as "General discussion - When it doesn't fit anywhere else".

Doug, admin

Thanks for sharing, and making clear of your opinions.