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Personally I think option A is the safest one i.e keep the existing apparatus licensing arrangements with the same licence conditions.
As the WIA says, that option with the offer of negotiation re things to improve efficiency and cost savings for the ACMA.
I think it would be a fatal mistake to vote for option C, either on the assumption that it is going to happen anyway, or vote for option C with conditions, which the ACMA may or may not accept i.e. "you voted for option C well here it is, and we'll talk in the fullness of time about your conditions".
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(09-03-2021, 04:34 PM)VK3RX Wrote: Personally I think option A is the safest one i.e keep the existing apparatus licensing arrangements with the same licence conditions.
As the WIA says, that option with the offer of negotiation re things to improve efficiency and cost savings for the ACMA.
I think it would be a fatal mistake to vote for option C, either on the assumption that it is going to happen anyway, or vote for option C with conditions, which the ACMA may or may not accept i.e. "you voted for option C well here it is, and we'll talk in the fullness of time about your conditions".
A serious question:
Do you really think that the bureaucrats and bean counters actually care what the results of some poll run by some hobbyists are?
I certainly don't.
We can vote for whatever we like but given there is but a handful of us occupying what has become valuable spectrum and they clearly have the directive to reduce costs, then what option do they have?
Colin
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Given there are 14,000 (?) licensees that's not a small number, nor particularly the revenue of $55 annual renewal each, $80 for new licences and $51 variation.
Given what the ACMA does for us (very little, and largely what they do is automated), we are hardly a major drain on their resources.
Having been involved with a federal government department that has made various proposals to industry from time to time, on the occasions the industry has largely or totally said "no" to something, it would have been brave to just go ahead with whatever the department wanted.
Complaints to the Minister and bad publicity would have resulted, and the Minister doesn't want either.
There does seem to be a fatalistic belief & assumption in some quarters that irrespective of the poll response, the ACMA will just go ahead and implement option C anyway.
I just think that the safest and sensible response is option A, with negotiations for efficiencies and cost savings.
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(09-03-2021, 06:32 PM)VK3RX Wrote: Given there are 14,000 (?) licensees that's not a small number, nor particularly the revenue of $55 annual renewal each, $80 for new licences and $51 variation.
<snip>
I know this is rehashing things from earlier in this thread but 14,762 licensees renewing at $55 is $811,910.
Last year the ACMA had a total income of $1,415,245,000.
Our gross contribution to that number is a bit under 0.06% which is 3/5th of 5/8th of nothing. We have no financial clout. Our numbers and income stream are inconsequential. ACMA bureaucrats are not elected so votes are not foremost in their minds and even if they were, 14762 votes spread over every electorate averages out to less than 100 votes per electorate.
Now given the demographics of the average amateur I would think that many of those 14.762 are set in their ways, rusted on single party voters plus, again given the demographics, the typical swinging vote cohort member would be more concerned with other more fundamental issues (pensions, franking credits, tax dodges etc) so are unlikely to change their vote based on ACMA licence changes. So we are probably down to a maximum of 20 or 30 votes per electorate. A number way less that accidental informal votes.
By all means vote in the WIA poll and register your concerns with your local MO, ACMA and the Communications Minister (I intend to do just that) but don't fool yourself into thinking we have any great resources backing us.
Also keep in mind we are competing against interests that have huge financial interests in buying spectrum and are large political donors.
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From WIA News for 14 Mar 2021:
On Monday March 15th at 7.30pm Eastern Daylight time (0830z) the WIA will attempt something new in an effort to communicate with members the scope and challenges presented by the ACMAs Consultation paper on Future Amateur Radio Service licensing. Members of the board and the Spectrum Strategy committee will be appearing live on HamRadioDX YouTube channel.
The aim is to provide a forum where the findings of the committee so far can be presented, but also provide an opportunity for questions and answers to be exchanged with members and the wider amateur community. The WIA will discuss the three options and why it is recommending the option it is.
We will also explain ways that the risks of ACMAs proposals could be mitigated to the benefit of both the amateur service and the ACMA.
During the 45 minute session, there will be time for questions via the YouTube chat feedback channel. Questions can also be submitted ahead of time via email to spectrum@wia.org.au Please note, that channel will be moderated, and only questions directly related to the submission will be accepted. We also ask that people be respectful and understand that we will not be commenting on the positions of others. This is about the WIAs position and making sure people are clear on what we have found and what the next steps are going to be. The WIA will in particular introduce the next steps that it needs members to take in the consultation process.
The discussion panel consists of Scott VK3KJ, Dale VK1DSH, Lee VK3GK and Grant VK5GR representing the Wireless Institute of Australia's (WIA) Spectrum Strategy team and also the WIA Board will be appearing live on Ham Radio DX YouTube channel.
www.youtube.com/watch?v=l9yy3fFEts8
We look forward to seeing you on YouTube on Monday night!
.........................
Now add another item into the fray :
"Back in December, the Radiocommunications Legislation Amendment or the Reform and Modernisation Act 2020 received Royal Assent, amending the Radiocommunications Act 1992:
The Modernisation Act is part of the Australian governments response to the recommendations of the 2015 spectrum review.
The amendments made by the Modernisation Act: add flexibility to the way we manage spectrum provide greater clarity to licensees simplify and streamline spectrum management and planning processes ensure that spectrum management is fit-for purpose in a challenging, dynamic environment.
The provisions of the Modernisation Act are due to come into force June 17 2021
"
Ed: Now that might open the door for easier amateur service licensing changes to be enacted by the ACMA - including class licensing !!!!
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A courteous reminder that the live stream is tonight!
Look forward to having you all on there.
[Video: https://youtu.be/l9yy3fFEts8]
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Interesting statements/discussions and chat happened during the youtube session ...
Next steps are :
. WIA Poll vote (if a member)
. Individual submissions to the ACMA BEFORE the closing date of 2nd April 2021, members and non-members alike.. That means you too.
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Completely forgot about the live stream, but watched the recording this morning 
Many thanks to you Hayden for facilitating it and MCing, and also to the WIA for all the work they are doing.
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Damien
I almost forgot too. I was having dinner and happened to glance at the clock. Fortunately I had clicked on Hayden's link earlier and it was there on screen waiting for me to hit Play. Good to know that it is still available. I noted that there were about 350 on-line at one stage, dropping to the 320-mark towards the end.
My vote on the WIA Poll was submitted a few minutes ago - option (A) - but have spent my morning cross-referencing the ACMA-supplied documents plus the WIA statement to derive my response document to submit to the ACMA. The first draft is complete and I will return to it later to re-read and check what I missed.
I will email my draft MSWord document to anyone who PMs me that they want it, and they can edit as desired with their comments and then submit as their own. I am not sure when the short-form WIA submission document (as was mentioned last night) will be available, possibly later this month.
What became apparent during last night’s WIA session is that we have to make individual submissions to make the numbers count.
Every submission = 1 vote and even the detailed WIA submission = 1 vote.
P.S. : the RASA position on this review makes for interesting reading :
https://vkradioamateurs.org/acma-proposed-changes-faq/
...and.. probably better explained in ....
https://vkradioamateurs.org/rasa-interim...d-changes/
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I will be filing a submission also, and would appreciate a look at yours in due course.
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My submission for IFC 01/2021 just hit the ACMA system, 6 pages in a PDF file. I feel I have now done my bit and now we await the outcome.
'This paper sets out options and proposals for public consideration. We are seeking stakeholder views on options being considered under the review:
Option A: keep the existing apparatus licensing arrangements with the same licence conditions
Option B: simplify the current licensing arrangements and licence conditions by amending the Radiocommunications Licence Conditions (Amateur Licence) Determination 2015 (Amateur LCD)
Option C: transition to class licensing arrangements for amateur stations operating on common frequencies (non-assigned amateur stations). The operation of amateur beacon and repeater stations (assigned amateur stations) would continue to be authorised under apparatus licensing arrangements, possibly with new arrangements for frequency coordination and assignment.'
Make sure you get your submission in as well, even if it simply states " I support Option A (or B or C), your name, email address, callsign".
File formats accepted : gif, jpg, png, bmp, txt, rtf, odf, pdf, doc, docx, ppt, pptx, xls, xlsx, gz, rar, tar, zip
Link to submit : https://www.acma.gov.au/form/consultatio...ty_id=3055
Closing date is 2nd April 2021, but preferably submit yours before that date rather than on the day.
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BUMP..
The submissions to the ACMA close Friday NEXT WEEK but a better deadline would be Thursday next week, 1st April (and no, not a joke).
You need to voice your selection by making a submission.
All of the references you require are noted in the earlier posts against this thread.
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WIA submision documents now available via this web page :
https://www.wia.org.au/newsevents/news/2.../index.php
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BUMP.. There are really ONLY two full days (Wed & Thu) left to make sure your submission arrives at the ACMA before the cutoff date.
Lodging details for submissions are listed in previous posts.
It can't be stressed strongly enough how important this is to the future of Amateur Radio in Australia...
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Anything other than option A is a trick by the australian government
Who started all this disruption?
vk6ro
e&oe
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It is not new that when someone approaches you with a 'proposal for change', it will almost always majorly benefit the proposer and those who suffer the change will be adversely affected.
This has happened so many times before... In this case the ACMA reduces staff, workload and costs while we lose out on features and functions.
I hope everyone has emailed or uploaded their submission by now, closes tomorrow arvo.
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Did mine a couple of days ago.
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Sent mine off earlier in the week.
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From 2021 JUNE 6 VK NATIONAL NEWS BROADCAST ON VK1WIA :
"
WIA Meets ACMA over the Review of Non-assigned Amateur Licence Arrangements.
The Wireless Institute of Australia (WIA) met recently with relevant staff from the Australian Communications and Media Authority (the ACMA), to discuss its public consultation process regarding the review of non-assigned amateur and outpost stations regulatory arrangements Note 1.
The aim of the meeting was to seek clarity on aspects of the ACMAs proposal that were unclear; to discuss specific areas of concern; and to understand the next steps in the process.
The ACMA staff began by stating that they appreciated the detailed WIA submission, and thanked us for the very thorough response. They reaffirmed the intention that the utility of an amateur licence will not be changed by this process, an important consideration raised in the WIA submission.
In seeking to better understand the ACMA position, the WIA asked questions about Class licensing and how interference management in particular would change, given statements in the ACMAs proposal.
The ACMA staff indicated that they are fully aware of the importance of interference issues to the amateur community and explained that current interference management policies and processes would certainly remain, even if the amateur service transitioned to a Class licence. Those responsibilities are set down separately in the Radiocommunications Act, and apply regardless of licence type.
The WIA and the ACMA staff then went on to discuss various other matters, including the listing of Amateur Stations within the Register of Radiocommunications Licences (RRL), call signs, reciprocal licensing and the value, utility and uses that the RRL provides to the Amateur service. This was fruitful and will lead to further discussions with ACMA on this area.
The meeting also covered the topics of the ACMAs proposed Amateur Accredited Persons scheme for managing repeater and beacon applications, and the need for supporting documentation to enable changes to how these are handled. The proposed amateur operator handbook was also briefly discussed.
Finally, the next steps in this consultation process were discussed. The ACMA staff advised that it is currently reviewing the submissions received to the public consultation. Once that review is complete, the submissions will be published by the ACMA. The ACMA also noted that the next update is likely during the 3rd quarter of 2021.
The WIA thanked the ACMA staff for the opportunity to discuss the issues of concern within the Amateur community, and expressed its desire to hold follow up meetings focusing on particular aspects of our submission and of the proposed reform.
Overall, the meeting was very positive and productive, and the WIA is looking forward to working with ACMA further on these matters.
Wireless Institute of Australia 31 May 2021
Notes 1. Australian Communications and Media Authority Consultation number IFC 01/2021
Review of non-assigned amateur and outpost regulatory arrangements:- tinyurl.com/2aatead6
"
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The latest news is out on this topic...
Visit the ACMA at https://www.acma.gov.au/consultations/20...ion-012021? and be prepared to do some heavy-ish reading !!!
[PDF created for those without a suitable version of MSWord..
ACMA review non-assigned outcomes IFC21-01.pdf (Size: 625.5 KB / Downloads: 294)
]
" Outcome: Consultation on review of non-assigned amateur and outpost licensing arrangements
We recently requested your feedback on our review of non-assigned amateur and outpost licensing arrangements. We appreciate the high level of engagement from the amateur radio community — over 800 submissions were received from individual amateurs, amateur radio clubs, the Wireless Institute of Australia and the Radio Amateur Society of Australia.
A Response to submissions paper, which summarises the key issues, concerns and recommendations raised during the consultation and the ACMA’s response to each, as well as the submissions are available on the ACMA website.
After considering the matters raised in submissions, we are confident that we can modify the proposed arrangements to address the main concerns identified, so that we can implement the proposed amateur class licence.
This way, we can address the key issues and other suggestions made by the amateur community that will enhance the proposed class licence, while meeting our objective to simplify the regulatory arrangements and reduce administrative, regulatory, and financial burdens on amateur licensees.
We will continue to work on incorporating these changes into the class licence and will update the amateur community regularly as we finalise our position on these matters."
More details on the ACMA web site via the link provided above.
Probably still lots of things to be confirmed but it shows the ACMA path.
Doug, VK4ADC
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