AHRDF domain expiry coming closer..

[VK4ADC]

The AHRDF.NET domain name expires on 8 July 2022, having been registered on 8th July 2017 - for a 5 year initial term.

I know that this date is still some 8 months away but I have a decision to make before then : keep the forum going or close it down.......

My original plan was to provide a replacement functionality for the VKLogger forum since it was rumoured to be closing - which it has since done (- and here comes a big BUT -)  BUT the number of posts and even registered daily visitor numbers has dropped over the not-so-recent period to make me question whether it should continue after the current domain expiry date.

Initially I had a few alternate 'admins' who could look after it when I was unavailable but these have been lost due to inactivity, deaths or relocations.  So it has just been 'me' for the last couple of years and, while it is not a gigantic workload, it still involves approving new applicants and reading every post - daily..

I will be 'watching' it's use over the next 6 months and will make a decision on/before 1st June 2022, just so I can give some notice (a month) to users in the event that it is closing.

This old saying comes to mind : Use it or lose it !!

Finally, I am not looking for responses to this thread : the next 6 months activities' will decide the forum's fate.  


Doug VK4ADC, admin.

[VK2KRR]

I actually thought it seemed to be gaining more use lately.
It would see an increase across summer I should think.
Integration with the Spotter was a good idea also.

[VK2XTC]

I've only just found this forum after a long COVID Induced hibernation.

I've not seen it listed elsewhere and it has not appeared in my other Facebook Ham Radio Groups.

Where is the link to the go fund me page with a default $5 donation. I pay for my other 'Free" ham radio software , why not this.

Suggest you post a repost from here to the other Facebook sites as that might trigger some interest.


Brian

[VK2CSW]

I've only just found this forum after a long COVID Induced hibernation.

I've not seen it listed elsewhere and it has not appeared in my other Facebook Ham Radio Groups.

Where is the link to the go fund me page with a default $5 donation. I pay for my other 'Free" ham radio software , why not this.

Suggest you post a repost from here to the other Facebook sites as that might trigger some interest.


Brian

Awww geez.

Now you've gone and done it!  You mentioned the "F" word...

[VK4ADC]

I've not seen it listed elsewhere and it has not appeared in my other Facebook Ham Radio Groups.

Where is the link to the go fund me page with a default $5 donation. I pay for my other 'Free" ham radio software , why not this.

Brian

I was not, am not, seeking donations.  The question arises as to whether to continue AHRDF.NET come this next July, and it isn't about money.

Sure, I pay for annual hosting and the domain name costs (ie renewal, the initial period I paid for was 5 years up in July [ yes, it has been running for 4 1/2 years now] ) but it is more about it's future usefulness - given that "F" word you mentioned.  I am not particularly interested in promotion on Facebook Groups as that is likely to result in even more workload than I already have - if I have to moderate (say) a new one.. Defeats the purpose of this forum.

A side benefit ??   I get to read every post, edit the odd one too without the originator even knowing, check out new applicants and approve or reject them....  That usually happens multiple times per day when things get 'busy' and most of my previous helpers / moderators have now ascended to the big DX gateway in the sky, are inactive now or otherwise busy with their lives. That leaves just me and I have to contemplate whether I want to, and can justify to myself and my XYL, run the forum ad infinitum.  

Non-renewal of the domain name makes that choice for me. To renew - or - not to renew ?  I will keep looking at usage ( new posts, registered visitor numbers etc ) for the coming months and if I can't see a 'usefulness happening' factor then it will have the drain plug removed and down the plughole it will go come July '21.  That old saying of 'use it or lose it' is the basis of the forum's future.
 
Enough moaning, enjoy it while it's available.

Doug, admin

[VK5PJ]

Hey Doug,
I know its still a long way till the renew date but if you are erring towards closure, would you consider passing it along to a new janitor to look after? It is frustrating to see the created content go to a bit bucket yet again and would like to see if we can find a stable home and janitors for the forum.

[VK5BC]

Hi Doug

Thank you for the effort you have put in, I have not been a big user but tend to look at posts now it is available from VKSpotter. Like you have have no interest in chasing around Facebook to find information that IMO should or could have been posted on VKSpotter where the large majoriy of VK/ZL vhf operators follow what is happening.

MXmas 73's Brian
VK5BC

[VK5ZLR]

There are those of us who refuse to acknowledge the existence of the F thing.
And who do not know, or wish to know, what happens there....
So I think this forum has a useful place.

[VK7ZPD]

FB is a dogs breakfast IMHO catering for people who need to feed their egos. It has no real structure and search capabilities are a joke. Not sure why there aren’t more posts but I think this forum is needed.

[VK7HH]

Would hate to see another forum go down the gurgler... don't do an Adam on us...

[VK3ASC]

Hi Doug,

If you need a hand to manage the forum, I would be more than happy to become a moderator on this forum.

Cheers
Mark VK3ASC

[VK4ADC]

I have been asked what I plan to do about the forum nearer domain expiry time. The best answer I can give at the moment is what I supplied in a reply by email ( with a few bits edited  ) :
"
At this stage, not sure what I will do.
There is still another 6 months before actual expiry and as I have indicated/posted, I will assess the usage and value over the coming months.
Then, at a minimum for continuing, I will be looking for moderators and/or administrators to assist.


I turned 71 last month and my health over the last 18 months has not been terrific. Medications have helped but I guess I am just ‘feeling my age’ at the moment.

My FT8 operations on both 6M and HF are a bit of a distraction and I can do that “recliner-portable from the house (lounge room)” easily enough for FT8, since my shack is up in the back yard – and mostly remoteable, including antenna switching and rotator directions. Depends on how I feel any given day as to whether I physically visit the shack !
"
I need to add that my condition is not terminal but that arthritic pain can be self-limiting in terms of what you can, or want to, physically do. Some days I just don't.

That opens the door to offers like Mark VK3ASC has made, and I will look at that shortly, but will probably need other offers of support too.
If you wish to volunteer as a Moderator (etc) then send me a PM via the forum - but don't expect an immediate acceptance.. 
When a number have come through then I will select the 2-3-4 needed based on prior forum activities and apparent knowledge.

The Moderator tasks are not onerous but are consistent :
Read every post and edit/delete as needed, usually multiple times each day so improper posts do not persist.
Activate new users after working through an approval sequence/process. 
Common sense and reliability is required.   

The Administrator tasks would be minimal as I would anticipate still doing version/security updates personally, at least into the foresee-able future.
Occasionally something 'breaks' and needs fixing but fortunately that is now not very often.

I re-iterate : I am not seeking $$ donations. I will be seeking assistance from would-be Moderators and/or Administrators, and MYBB experience would be helpful, regardless.

I expect that this will be my final statement on the domain renewal subject until around May/June 2022.

Doug, admin

[VK4ADC]

The question about the forum's future has again come to the fore with an email received this afternoon, part of which says :
"
IF YOUR DOMAIN IS *NOT* ENROLLED IN OUR AUTOMATED DOMAIN RENEWAL SERVICE, YOU WILL NEED TO RENEW IT MANUALLY WITHIN THE NEXT 60 DAYS OR YOU WILL LOSE YOUR DOMAIN NAME.

The name due for renewal is:

Domain Name, Expiry Date
ahrdf.net, 2022-07-08
"

I have been keeping an eye on the activity most days for quite some time to see how many "member" visitors actually visit each day.  On average, that number is about 20, down to about 13-14 some days and up to the mid-20s other days. 

Given that there are over 600 'supposed' members, it poses the question " Should the forum be continued ??"  It has been on-line for 5 years as of the 8th July 2022 yet its use seems minimal by almost any yardstick you care to select.

The following should be added :  It is not the cost of the domain renewal and the web site hosting but adding the justification for the time expended in maintaining the forum - granting access to new members, proofing every post, occasionally updating the forum code.  Is it worth me doing ad infinitum ?? 

So, do I renew the domain registration or not ???    In the event that I do, I will be seeking the support of a number of people, preferably with at least some experience in similar forum administration, to do most of the day-to-day management as required.  It is not a heavy workload given the low usage rate, and I will not be removing myself from it totally, but someone else needs to be looking over "posts" and activating users - in Moderator roles - this has still to be done periodically.  'Offers' of assistance can be made by PM or direct email - many of you know my email address.

The alternative path is that come the 9th July, the domain name will no longer resolve and access will cease entirely. The files and database will then be totally junked from the hosting server. I am not interested in passing domain ownership plus the current database. If you aren't prepared to use this forum, you most likely won't use a re-birth under another domain name either.

I have other projects on-the-go that may very well consume large amounts of my time well into the future, some AR and some not, so continuing is an each-way bet in my mind.

So is it worth my while ??      Convince me.... You have about 30 days (maximum) to do so.

Doug, admin
10th May 2022

[VK6RO]

""minimal by almost any yardstick""

But to me personally a very interesting forum and i do not know of any other VK forum we can use that is VK based.

I do not do that ""book"" thing that people talk about

So if it is decided to close down you have my support and thanks for everything and see you on the bands.

tnx

graham vk6ro

[VK5TM]

I've just deleted bookmarks for 3 forums that have disappeared in the last couple of weeks, so I think it's a sign of the times.

My thanks also for giving it a go and what ever will be, will be.

[VK4SMJ]

I think if only on average 20 or so out of 600+ browse daily, I feel it is time to close shop.

I think forums in general have a declining user base. I asked my 25 year old son the other day, how many forums does he visit. Yep, none, zero. He even said that its an old persons thing!!

Not sure I agree with him, but if it is that way, it's kinda sad. I have always used forums for info and to ask questions. Times change even if we dont like it. Part of my daily ritual is to visit this site. BTW, my son also said facebook was for old people as well!!

Doug, Not worth your time mate not for the numbers involved. I'll miss it though.

P.S. Recently Doug I realised who you are. And remember you at Tim Armstrong's(VK4LZY) Funeral, I'd like to thank you for your kind gesture that day. I am Tims mate and brother in-law. I can tell you his loss is felt in my house daily.

Regards to all

[VK5PJ]

I have and still do feel forums still have a place in AR, if you do a search for HAM related information, how many times do you find the information you needed as part of an answer provided to another's question in a forum?  the answer to that is more often than not.

Forums are a place to ask, discuss and answer questions about our hobby...  a place where information is accumulated for all to see and benefit from. It would seem that it has become a common thing for the owners to get hung up on the number of visitors and 'foot traffic' through the door. these are not always the true indicator of a forums worth. 

The VKLOGGER forums died, I felt, because its then owner became obsessed over the traffic numbers and then forced even casual viewers to register to see any content.  I had invested greatly in the VKLOGGER forums and then found my content was at first locked as read only then dumped in the trash.  I would hope this forum is not going to be a repeat of my earlier experience.

If there is not going to be any stability why would people invest their time in a platform that is not going to last the distance?

I for one would dearly love for this platform to go on into the future and not have us all get dispersed and find a new spot to share and discuss AR topics.

Doug how do we keep it alive, clearly the cost of domain registration is a sticking point for you as that was the focus of your earlier messages and I would guess hosting cost too? along with time to administer the system, some are keen to help on many of those fronts so please do not close the shutters.

[VK4ADC]

Peter

I indicated that it was not the financial side that was the issue, that was true before, still true now.  If I can't afford both domain renewal and hosting then I might as well give up AR completely too. I accept the comments about it being a useful source of historical posts and data but so were printed newspapers - and how many of those have disappeared in the last few years ??

It is more the time and access constraints that will be more of a future effect for me, so checking the forum for new posts each and every day, and even doing so multiple times per day, in a administration/moderation role and authenticating new "members" is likely to be a waste of my time when time becomes tight in supply..  Hence that last help request.  I am not planning on jumping ship and having nothing further to do with this forum post-July 2022 should it keep going.  I have 'invested' 5 years in the forum under this name, a bit more under the OzLogger name, so it is not that I am taking this matter lightly.

What you, and others, need to see is that the current levels of activity do not make for useful expenditure of my resources : time and money. 
Do I really want to close it ? NO, but that is the likely outcome given the status quo.

Two things will save the forum (with both required) : 
(1) a LOT more daily activity to show that it is a useful resource to MANY; and 
(2) some volunteers to share that daily forum moderation role.

Those two factors are beyond my immediate control yet they control the AHRDF's destiny.

[VK3RX]

checking the forum for new posts each and every day, and even doing so multiple times per day

Why do you need to do this? Are there a number of spam posts and/or applications to join every day?

Other forums I'm on and been involved with for many years tend to run themselves, rarely any admin action.

Spam posts and other posts requiring some form of action are dealt with by moderators, and new applications to join get actioned by same. On one forum, we rarely hear from the admin from one year to the next.

As regards forums being on their way out and "an old persons thing". That's usually a comment by people who are not members of any themselves, never looked at or for forums recently or at all, and instead are happy with their own common interest world by other means. To each their own -

I'm a member of a number of radio/comms and general topics forums that have thousands of members both locally and overseas and get hundreds of posts per day. They show no sign of being on their way out.

[VK2KRR]

Keeping in mind that coming into Winter is traditionally that time of year when ham radio activity slows down for Australians.

Forums such as this absolutely have their place online.

Facebook may have a place too, but I fear its days are numbered with all the advertising bombardment, censorship and control for other agendas. The only real advantage is the potential wide array of people you can expose the hobby too which otherwise may not have any exposure into it.

I check in here now and then to see if there is any new posts or things I need to read up on. I think there is more activity on the forum now compared to what there used to be, seems to be growing though im not really looking at any factual stats. I cant say that I would check in every day, but mostly because there is not that many new posts.
Also if you can see post topics displayed on VKSpotter and they dont interest you or there has been no updates or additional posts, then there is no need to even visit the forum pages, so that could be another reason it could be lower visits to the forum itself.

So of course from my perspective I think the forum should remain in operation.